Fire doors slamming with chain closer

[Guest Kate]

Hello, I don't know if you can advise me but - recently moved into a flat in a purpose built block and all the internal doors in the flat are very heavy, (presumably fire doors) which will not stay open or ajar and close too heavily behind you, causing potential injury to hand or legs which might be in the way.
Can these doors be modified in some way to become 'normal'doors ?They appear to have a 3rd chain like hinge in the middle.
Thanks

[Tom Sutton]

It appears to be a single chain Perko type Concealed Door Closer which I believe is not able to be adjusted therefore unless you are able to replace it and it will continue to close heavily behind you. Approved Document B, Volume 2, says that all fire doors should be fitted with self closers except doors to cupboards and within flats however the front door (fire door) should be fitted with an approved self closer. Speak to your landlord and he/she may allow you to remove them and make good the holes left but you must ensure the front door (fire door) is fitted with an approved self closer.

[Guest Messier boy]

I have been receiving noise complaints because of the Perco Fire doors. Now disconnected. The doors in the rest of the block are not my concern & I've told the agents to get their maintenance people to adjust them.

[Safelincs]

You might need to consider adjustable concealed door closers. These are unfortunately quite a bit more expensive than the entry models without adjustment.

Harry

[Tom Sutton]

You need to check if the Perco door closers are being used as fire door self closers, because as far as I am aware there is only one that meets the requirements of a fire door closer, Powermatic, which meets the requirements of  BS EN 1154:1997 and is adjustable. Check out http://www.firesafe.org.uk/fire-door-fitting-and-ironmongery/

[Geoff C]

Hi Guys

I know this is an old post, but biting on to what Tom said,  `It appears to be a single chain Perko type Concealed Door Closer which I believe is not able to be adjusted` there are thousands if not millions of those old style brass coloured single chain types still out there (lots with broken chains) . IF still in situ, and working ok, do they need to be changed as they obviously wouldnt have conformed to standards we have now, ? 

cheers

[Neil Ashdown MAFDI]

Hi Geoff,

This type of closing device was commonly fitted to FD20 internal fire doors inside flats and houses. Many hardware suppliers call them 'slammers' as they are not adjustable for closing strength and speed but are cheaper to buy than adjustable self-closers. They are not suitable for flat entrance doors and fire doors in common areas as they are not compliant with regulations that require such devices to be a minimum of power-size 3 to BS EN 1154.

If you have them fitted to doors inside your flat or house there is no legal requirement to upgrade, indeed a change in building regulations no longer requires fire doors protecting staircases in dwelling houses and fire doors protecting inner lobbies in flats to be self-closing. There is guidance here https://www.local.gov.uk/sites/default/files/documents/fire-safety-purpose-built-04b.pdf

However, people do sometimes regard these self-closers to be a nuisance and often remove the complete device or sometimes just the chain itself. Any alteration to a fire door may affect its performance so if a concealed closer is removed then the void left inside the door / doorframe must be competently repaired.

[Geoff C]

Cheers Neil

appreciated

Geoff

[Guest Conrad]

Hi

I want to specify a concealed door closer for some front doors to flats. The doors are solid timber and 1 Hr fire rated, and I am concerned a concealed closer might invalidate the integrity of the fire rating. Does anyone know of a suitable closer?

[Neil ashdown]

There are jamb concealed self-closer devices that may be suitable such as the Powermatic R100. However, you must check that the door leaf is suitable for that type of device and this will depend on the door core construction type. 

Check the certification data sheet, technical manual, evidence of performance etc. for the door leaf.

[Guest South East London Resident]

Can anyone give me any advice?  It looks like I will have to move as for over 3 years I have been suffering noise from one of the nightmare slammer Perko door closers which the council installed in my neighbour's property.  The council will not remove the closer even though I understand it is not a requirement under current fire regulations in a single dwelling property.  I keep being woken up during the night at all hours leading to loss of sleep and it is affecting my overall heath and work performance. 

[Tom Sutton]

This is a noise problem and outside the remit of this forum, you could try the environmental health of your local council.

[Guest Kathleen Mc]

We have these throughout our townhouse and they are the bane of my life. They don't even give you enough time to walk through whilst holding 2 cups of tea. It's like a round of the Krypton factor.

Push door handle with elbow, whilst trying not to spill tea. Kick door as wide as possible. Buffet door on backside as it closes, again trying not to spill tea. Walk thru, catching door with ankle to try and slow down the closure so it doesn't bang.

I really wish you could have them so they stay open and close slowly like the fire doors with the big brass hinges. I'm glad i don't have kids. I reckon a few fingers could get broken if not worse.

[AnthonyB]

If they are on an internal door you can cut the chains - it used to be a requirement to fit these a long time ago, but this was dropped some years ago.