Electricity cupboards

[Guest Brendan]

I have purchased a new build flat and the utility cupboard which houses fuse box etc doesn't have Fire doors, are they supposed to have them? (And which regulation?) thanks 

[AnthonyB]

Where is the cupboard in relation to your flat hallway and are the electric fuseboards plastic or metal?

[Guest Roberto]

Hi everyone. I have a large fuseboard electrical cupboard constructed of painted wood in the commonways of a house comprising of 4 self-contained flats that requires 60 mins mins fire protection. It’ is 1670 x 1370mm - too big to be housed in a metal fire resistant outer and it can’t be moved - please see the cupboard photo. Therefore the intention is to: 1). rip out the wooden enclosure. 2). Erect a metal stud work frame compatible with the use of Promatect 500 calcium silicate 35mm board which has the desired 60 mins fire protection. 3). Cut and fit a 1-hour rated fire door for 2 leaves.
My question is a). what should constitute the component parts please to ensure the finished cupboard meets the requirements for 60 minutes minimum fire protection in terms of: fire rated screws, door hinges, intumescent strips, smoke seals, fire stop sealant and anything else you suggest is required? b). How should these components be configured? e.g. What seals on the door leaves and where? Is there any manual online available to follow for fire-proofing a cupboard and building a fire proof cupboard from scratch? I haven’t been able to find a guide. Thank you very much.

[Guest Guest Dean]

In relation to the wiring going into the cavity and/or flat, is there any regulation that says this needs to be suitably firestopped in order to stop the smoke spreading through building in the event of a fire? 

 

Seeing this get picked up a lot on FRA's??

[AnthonyB]

The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005 - 8 Duty to take general fire precautions.

The fire stopping forms part of the general fire precautions to ensure, so far as is reasonably practicable, the safety of any of his employees; and in relation to relevant persons who are not his employees, take such general fire precautions as may reasonably be required in the circumstances of the case to ensure that the premises are safe - by stopping the spread of fire/smoke though the building affecting escape.

[DJR]

Hi there,

I was hoping someone might be able to help me! I live in a Victorian terrace building with 5 flats. The existing electrics cupboard requires fireproofing.  However, underneath the cupboard is a Ryfied box and the main electric tails coming into the building from the floor (see blue box on photo).  Can someone tell me if these elements also need to be put in a fireproof enclosure?  I'm getting mixed messages from electricians and builders quoting for the works.

Your help is much appreciated!

Thanks!

[Guest Meters]

Any advice appreciated on how I can get a ready made 30 min fire resistant cupboard for meters housed in communal external  corridor please? Is there somewhere that sells them or do you have to make it yourself? If you have to make it yourself what should it be made out of? Any help appreciated. 

[Guest MikeB]

I own a flat in a residential block - 13 flats in total over 2 storeys, built in the late 1990s.  Each flat has its own electricity meter cupboard, these cupboards are in the indoor communal areas (hallways/landings).  Each flat occupant (owner or tenant as the case may be) is responsible for reading their own meters.

A Fire/Health & Safety survey was recently carried out and flags that the electricity meter cupboards should be fitted with 30-minute fire proof doors with intumescent strips and locks.   As far as I can tell these were not requirements at the time the building was built, but for new builds they are and have been since at least 2015 (BS 9991).

In due course I expect the doors will be upgraded to match current regulations, but I'm trying to determine whether this is actually a legal requirement given that the building pre-dates the regulations.  I've spent a lot of time on internet searches but haven't been able to come up with a definitive, official (gov.uk etc.) source of information.

Can anyone point me in the right direction?

[AnthonyB]

New standards are not retrospective as a matter of course, but do have to be considered in a risk assessment - "It was OK originally" is no automatic defence anymore. The FRA should consider the difference in protection between the new & old ways of doing things, also accounting for the size, layout, occupancy & type of preemies and any other compensatory measures in place. This is why small older blocks don't need to replace old style fire doors, but may need to fit modern self closers.

Without seeing the construction of the existing cupboards and the meters within it's impossible to say that they do or don't need changing (you can post photos on here which would help) but it's not a given they need replacing - options the risk assessment has are:
- Do nothing - risk is tolerable

- Upgrade existing cupboards

- Replace to current spec

[Guest MikeB]

Thankyou Anthony.  I expect they will be replaced as a matter of course but was curious about the legal aspect and whether it can come down to the way the particular inspector interprets the 'rules'.   (Digression: I had a situation with an EICR where the electrician basically marked some things which didn't comply with today's BS7671 as a C1 (dangerous, fail, must be addressed) and quoted a lot of money to fix them, I found the EICR guidelines which stated clearly that they were not C1 but he just wouldn't have it.  This was a case of him blindly applying todays regs in full to an older building.  I ended up getting another electrician in who did the job by the guidelines.)

It's only the door,  surround and lack of lock that is mentioned, not the cupboard itself.  The picture I have isn't very informative:

Anyway, as I say I'm sure we will err on the safe side and replace them, I was just curious about the retro-application of new regs.  I can see that it makes sense for it to be on a case-by-case basis taking into account the actual situation.  I suspect that different inspectors will come up with different judgements.

[AnthonyB]

There will be a difference in judgement as it's a non prescriptive system - some assessors play it safe and err to modern standards others actual risk assess and take a pragmatic approach as supported by the guidance. Ultimately if matters ever went to legal proceedings it's up to the Court (or the Secretary of State if a determination is sought prior to prosecution to resolve a difference of opinion between enforcer and RP as to an acceptable solution) to decide what was correct in a particular case.

[Guest MikeB]

Thankyou very much for your advice, much appreciated.