Fire exit signs pointing up or down?

[Guest KarenL]

Good evening. Please can you advise if it is okay to place a fire exit sign with a downward arrow above a doorway to indicate that the fire exit route is through the door or is that just to indicate downstairs?

Also if the front door of a building is being used as a fire escape can we use a green exit sign or does it need to say Fire Exit?

kind regards, Karen

[Guest Safety Signs Express]

Hi Karen

An upward arrow on a fire exit sign should be used above a doorway if the direction is either straight on from here or straight on and up from here. A downward arrow should only be used if the fire exit is straight on and down from here.

With regards to sign posting your final exit door, as it it is used as a normal exit as well, the green exit sign is correct as the exit is not specifically used just in an emergency but the word exit should be accompanied with the running man symbol in the direction of the exit but with no arrow. The sign should be placed above the door if possible. If not possible it should be placed where the sign can be clearly seen and is less likely to be obscured by smoke.

However, if the main door is being used as a fire exit, as well as an exit, and it is possible that the exit can be obstructed from the outside i.e. parked cars, you will need a fire exit / keep clear sign on the outside of the door.

I hope this helps.

[Tom Sutton]

To add to the above submission check out http://www.fia.uk.com/en/info/document_summary.cfm/docid/E2CF2288-5FBA-4A49-85150B74D5060E17 for the Fire Industry Association guide on fire signs. It refers to old standards but there is very little difference the current standard is BS EN ISO 7010.

[Guest Emc]

Hi. I am confused which directional arrow I should use above a doorway that opens on to a small landing with stairs going up and down.  In case of a fire I want to direct people down.  Should I use the up arrow on the doorway to progress through to the landing, then have a downward left on the landing to direct down the stairs?  The doorway is close to the stairs, I'm concerned the up arrow on the door could be misleading.  Can the downward arrow be used above the door and be understood to still progress through with intention of going down?  Many thanks 

[AnthonyB]

Strict interpretation of the signage rules is the use of an up arrow above the door as up is for straight on as well as up. When through the door you have another change of direction requiring another sign for the stairs (usually diagonal down & left, or down & right depending on how the stairs run) 

[Elaine]

Thank you very much for your response.  That's how I have understood the regs.  But my personal view is an upward arrow in a time of panic could be misunderstood as has two meanings and could send someone in the wrong direction!  Best stick to the regs, thanks again. 

[Tom Sutton]

The arrow up means straight on which is the same convention that you would interpret from an arrow or direction information anywhere else. That is an understood convention. Check out arrow signs on traffic lights and road signs. The Standard BS 5499 Part 4 2000 is so simple and is replicated worldwide within ISO 7010 and ISO 16069 Safety Way-Guidance Standard.

A possible solution could be if you put the sign on the floor like map it would point through the door, if you then raise it up to 90 degrees it points upwards, could it be why the upward arrow has been accepted for straight on.

[Guest Mr Confused]

Hi, If I have a final exit door that once you pass through it you are on the same level but you need to immediately turn left toward the Assembly Point, do I install a sign internally above this final exit door with the arrow pointing up or to the left please?

[AnthonyB]

Up to make you go through that door. If there is a change of direction after the door then you add the additional sign there. There is no go through and then turn sign.

Left arrow above a door means don't use the door go left instead.

[Guest Mr Confused]

Thank you AnthonyB

[Guest James Gorman]

is viewing distance measured from size of panel/size of blade or size of graphic 

eg if there is a white border around the green running man graphic or clear transparent space border - where is the neasurem t taken from ?

[Tom Sutton]

The viewing distance is calculated using the overall height of the graphic symbol not the border and the luminance is also considered. Check out BS 5499-4:2000.

[Guest Scott208]

Hi, can anyone help. I have a customer who says that regulations state that exit signs need the word "exit" as well as a running man sign and an arrow. I can find no such regulation, but he says he got pulled on this when putting a sign up at an airport, and they had to replace the signs with ones that had wording on them. Can anyone throw any light on this?

[AnthonyB]

It's not a regulation, but the latest edition of the signage standards (ISO 7010) do say exit signs should include text unless in buildings where only staff would need to understand the signage. It's not retrospective unless a risk assessment deems it so (which any sensible one is unlikely to do so except in certainly specific cases).

Of course it's impossible to comply with where you need internally illuminated exit signs - they are still making these with obsolete arrows and symbols on so you won't see text legends for a long time yet!

[Guest Louise]

Hi

Please could someone advise best fire exit sign.  I work in a very old country house.  One fire exit is to go through a door and then turn immediately left through another door, and then once through here turning immediately left again (so the person would turn through 180degrees to get out).  do the fire exit signs with arrows diagonally up and to the left apply here? I was thinking I'd have straight up arrows above all doors but wondered when the up and left arrow would apply?

thanks in advance for any help given

[AnthonyB]

Are you going upstairs (or going to the corner of a large open area)? If not then you do not use the up/left arrow.

If you have to pass through a doorway it should have a compliant sign with an up arrow above it.

If you need to turn left there should be a compliant sign on the wall with a left arrow on it (although if it's a very small lobby/area such that as soon as you pass through the first door you can clearly see the next door and sign I might be tempted not to need the sign)

Change in direction, passing through a door and changing level all require their own signs, there are no shortcuts by putting anything other than an up arrow* above a door

 

* a lot of people put a down arrow above a door to point at the door to show 'this door' which is technically wrong, but a debate all in itself as to how much of a real issue it is.

[Guest Phil.Billington]

how are ordinary people to know to know this. this is also for people who come in off the street

[Tom Sutton]

I have more faith in the general public than you, if the signs are fixed as AB has indicated they would find there way out quite easily.

[Guest David Andrew]

I get this every time a contractor comes in to work on the lights on the fire doors leading on to the stairs at my school.  The doors open directly to the up fight of stairs. The down flight is adjacent to this.  Being a school I want the directional arrow to point downwards on all exit doors above ground floor level, as children are more likely to take a literal view of the sign that they see. There has been all kinds of reasoning along the lines of 'well that is the convention, think about if you are driving along a motorway....etc'. They can be real pedants over this.  In the end, they will get their way as they have been paid to make the building compliant and it is their signature on the document.  But honestly, this convention makes no bloody sense.  I have to think about Grenfell, and all the people who went up the tower, instead of down.

[green-foam]

Fire exit signs are to indicate the way out. The staff and children will know the way out, visitors will not know, so will be guided by what the signs indicate.

[AnthonyB]

Once you have gone through the doors there should be additional signage to direct people down stairs, the sign above the door relates to the door only.

People went up at Grenfell not because of signs, but because they couldn't go down as the stairs were heavily smoke logged due to a catalogue of failings in the various protective measures in the building.

[Guest Emma]

Hi, can anyone help, we need a fire exit sign for two of our doors both lead straight outside but it isn't possible to have them above the doors ... we are looking at one to go to the right of the door on the wall but I'm not sure what arrow to use. Would you use a left arrow as the door is to the left of the sign, or a straight up on as you need to go straight on through the door to the left of the sign or one of those corner ones? 

 

[Tom Sutton]

Use a standard FIRE EXIT sign with upwards arrow and fix to the door itself.

[AnthonyB]

Guidance says you shouldn't put exit signs on doors - is the headroom too low for a suspended sign?

[Tom Sutton]

Sorry about my faux pas, back in the sixties it was common to see this, but I do agree it is wrong, because if the door is open, you most likely to be unable to see the sign. 

Can you post an image of the doors in question.