How many fire exits do we need?

[Guest Blade]

Hi, we are planning to move a commercial/trade kitchen from ground floor into the basement with one stairway route only at present. 

A secondary route/window is required however the only possible other route is the beer hatch (0.4sqm) which could possibly have a removable stair attached to it as a mean of escape leading to a second ground floor exit door.

Would this be accepted as a second exit route? The distance is the same for both stairs and hatch. The number of people would be 10 maximum. There would be gas pipe present. 

Thank you

Blade

[AnthonyB]

If you are only having 10 people then you would not usually require a secondary exit route. If you did require a secondary route for some reason it would require a fixed stair

[Guest SCO]

On Thursday, October 29, 2015 at 13:24, Tom Sutton said:

You have to understand the evacuation procedure in most large blocks of flats it is called "stay put". These blocks of flats are divided into into fire resistant compartments that will resist the spread of fire for up to 60 minutes, which is sufficient time for the fire service to arrive and extinguish the fire.

This means the tenants can stay put in their flats providing it is not involved in fire or the location of the fire is such it is unsafe to do so. If the fire should spread due to bad compartmentation and if it affects any tenants they should evacuate immediately but the remainder can stay put if they choose to.

This evacuation procedure has been in use for 50 years and proved effective except in a relatively few cases were the people involved, did not understand the evacuation procedure properly. This means, the means of escape provided for you, excluding the use of the lifts, is satisfactory because of the small number of people that will need to use it.

Because of the terminology I would prefer, not to give it a title and let the people decide for themselves or call it, stay put if it is safe to do so. 

Check out http://www.local.gov.uk/web/guest/publications/-/journal_content/56/10180/3369777/PUBLICATION 

 

[Guest J20]

How many exits are needed in a 3 storey block containing 6 flats? At the moment only one stair well leading to main entrance which is the only exit point.

[Tom Sutton]

It is most probably fine but without knowing the layout and travel distances I cannot give a definitive reply.

Check out Approved Document B (fire Safety) volume 2: Premises other than Dwelling Houses. page 27.

[AnthonyB]

On 2017-6-18 at 11:01, Guest J20 said:

How many exits are needed in a 3 storey block containing 6 flats? At the moment only one stair well leading to main entrance which is the only exit point.

Completely fine - see this for more guidance http://www.local.gov.uk/web/guest/publications/-/journal_content/56/10171/3369777/PUBLICATION-TEMPLATE

 

[Tom Sutton]

AB the links doesn't work.

[AnthonyB]

13 hours ago, Tom Sutton said:

AB the links doesn't work.

So much for HM Government! Took the link from Gov.uk as it should be up to date!

 

Try https://www.local.gov.uk/fire-safety-purpose-built-flats

[Guest Guest]

Hello,

 

Is it possible in a building that only needs one direction fire escape and one fire escape stair for the fire escape stair to be on the outside of the building? 

 

Thanks,

[AnthonyB]

In theory yes, as long as the stair is suitably protected from a fire in the building.

[Guest Paul]

Hi I have just leased a pub in London and the kitchen has one entrance /exit that leads too seating area too bat which has two exits is this legal 

[AnthonyB]

As you are the Responsible Person in a licensed premises you must carry out a written Fire Risk Assessment. If you don't feel competent in this you need to use an external provider, preferably third party certified (BAFE SP205-1, Warrington FIRAS).

Guidance to help you carry it out yourself is here: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/fire-safety-risk-assessment-small-and-medium-places-of-assembly & here if you have living accommodation on site: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/fire-safety-risk-assessment-sleeping-accommodation

[Guest BartKsi]

Hi there!

Me and my friend thinking about opening our small hostel, up to 20 people. We are looking for 3 bedroom house. There is a chance, that this place might not be adjusted for a sleeping accommodation, that's why might not have an escape route. Would the main entrance satisfies legal requirement in terms of escape route? I have been looking for an answer, but I cannot find satisfying answer. Many thanks!

Bart

 

[Tom Sutton]

Twenty people, 3 bedroom house sounds a little optimistic but as far as fire safety is concerned until you have got your proposals on paper nobody can give you any advice; it will all depend on the layout of the premises. When you are working out the fire safety provisions required you should consult Approved Document B (fire Safety) volume 2: Premises other than Dwelling Houses which is the document you will need to meet, at the alteration stage.

[Guest Bungalow]

Hi,

I hope you can help me!We are living in a bungallow.We have a front door and a back door.We've never used the front door so we just consider to change it for a big window but we are not sure what the low saiz about it.

[Tom Sutton]

To do this you would need to get building regulations approval and Approved Document B (fire safety) volume 1: Dwellinghouses says that on the ground floor all habitable rooms have to open onto a hall, leading to a entrance or other suitable exit. Your proposals would not achieve this and consequently it would not get approval.

[Guest Phobia]

Hi,

I moved into an old apartment building on the lower floor.  I have one door which got stuck.  I tried to get out the windows but notice that they don't open.  Please advise me whether I should have at least another exit.

[Tom Sutton]

It depends on the layout of the apartment building and when it was constructed, there are situations when it is required but not always.

[Guest Simon]

Hi there, I'm looking at taking on a town house in the City Centre where I live. It consists of 4 floors and 6 bedrooms. There is a large central stair case and good thick walls (building is Victorian). My question is this, at what point does a building need an external fire escape? It's a grade 2 listed building and the windows are original so can't be replaced with modern versions.

Thanks

[Tom Sutton]

How do you intend to use it, as a single domestic occupancy or what, you should check out FIRE SAFETY Guidance on fire safety provisions for certain types of existing housing an answer to your enquiry should be in this guidance.

[Guest Cornwall Guest]

Hello,

Our office is about to be moved to a third floor office (in the roof space) in a recently renovated old building.  It will have around 30-40 staff with computer equipment and a small kitchen (it will be a bit cramped).  The windows are velux style roof ones in a lower than average height ceiling.  There is only a single point of entry / exit to the stairwell with a lift directly outside the door.

There is a bit of concern around if there was a fire in the lift shaft or stairwell.

Does this sound like it is within regs to not have an alternative exit?

Thanks

[Tom Sutton]

Not knowing the full layout and being familiar with the building I cannot give a satisfactory response but a fire risk assessment under The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005 should have been conducted and if the means of escape is unsatisfactory it would have been highlighted in the report, try to get a viewing of the FRA. 

[AnthonyB]

The stairwell is required to be what is a protected route, which should have at least 30 minutes fire resistance from a fire on any of the floors and itself be fire sterile so a fire does not start within it. This is why there are thousands of buildings in the UK, including new builds, with only one stair and all safe and legal.

The FRA should check that this situation is OK - as well as limits on travel distance and required exit widths there are limits on occupancy on a particular floor - as you are using the area as offices you require 6sq.m. per person and you could be overloading the floor

[Guest Concerned office designer]

Hi Tom Sutton, 

Thank you for all the responses, they provide useful information and links.

I am looking a first floor office design (15m x24m) open plan with fire escapes at each end. We are looking at installing a open plan kitchenette with toaster, electric hob and mircowave.

Is there any problem with this in the open plan space?

All areas of the office area with in 18m of one or more fire exits and unobstructed. 

Many thanks

 

[Tom Sutton]

Your proposals will be subject to Building regulations approval so it is up to building control to approve. I can see the means of escape being acceptable but installing a open plan kitchenette with toaster, electric hob and microwave is like to be viewed as a high fire risk and you may be required to enclose it, providing a open plan tea & coffee facilities most probably would be acceptable but including cooking devices is likely to be considered a step to far. Also if you have a fire detection especially smoke detectors you are likely to have false alarm problems.