Do flat owners under their own management need fire risk assessment?

[AnthonyB]

On 24/03/2022 at 14:02, Guest Sam guest said:

Hi Tom I’m selling my flat and the buyers solicitor is asking for a fire risk assessment 

what kind of stuff would flag up and does it need to be rectified by myself? Or the other co-feeeholders ? 

The FRA should be for the block, not the individual flat. Unfortunately from experience it could come up with a wide range of outcomes from no action/minor actions to substantial risks and significant remedial actions.
The responsible person would be required to remedy this - usually the freeholder or resident's management company depending on how the block is owned.

[Guest Caveman60]

We have a small, block of 4 converted flats in a 2-story 1920s building. The 4 flat-owners jointly own the freehold to the building through a RMC. 1 flat has a private ground-floor entrance and 3 open on to a communal hall, stairs and landing (1 ground, 2 first floor). We have examined the Lacors Housing Fire Safety Guide and under Case Study D10 note that while a "30-minute protected route is required, including FD30S fire doors to rooms opening onto escape route. It may be possible to accept an existing lower standard of protection in the protected route if there are suitable escape windows from bedrooms and living room." We have been advised in an externally commissioned Fire Safety Review that, as the building is judged "low-risk" and occupants are able-bodied with both first floor flats having escape windows opening onto accessible flat roofs, this removes the requirement to upgrade all the external front doors of the flats to FD30S standard. Is this the case?

[AnthonyB]

Do you have the required mixed fire alarm system in support of a full evacuate policy and what sort of flat front doors are already in place?

When was it converted?

The LACORS guide is obsolescent and was put under review in 2019 (which has stalled thanks to COVID) and so requires care in interpretation (many Council's have written their own up to date standards superseding parts of it) although most holds true still.

Interestingly a purpose built block of flats of similar age and layout wouldn't need new FD30S doors either as long as the original fire doors from the time of build were in place in good order (but you would still need a self closer)

[Guest Guest 101]

Hello Tom 

I just wanted to run this by you. 
I live in a converted Victorian house, converted pre 1991, there are 4 flats , across 2 floors, one on the ground floor, 2 on the 1st floor and one on the top floor. 
 

3 are rented out by landlords and I am a owner occupier on the ground floor. 
 

one of the landlords is selling their flat. 
A fire safety company has said we need to install a fire system, however from what I understand, pre 1991 you are not required to put in place fire defection, only fire separation methods. 
 

please can you comform if a fire alarm system is required?

and the fact I live in and own my flat - am I required to contribute to the changes the FRA is suggesting to the other live out landlords asking them to action ? Or can I opt out and just pay to make sure my own flat is fire proof?

Thanks alot 

 

[AnthonyB]

It's not anywhere near as simple as that.

A pre-1991 conversion would need extensive structural work to upgrade the fire resistance of all the ceilings and both the walls between flats and the walls between flats and common parts (including providing walls in any roof void) to give 60 minutes fire resistance. It would also need some form of smoke control system.

Only then would it be suitable for 'stay put' and not need a site wide common alarm.

Pulling down ceilings/pulling up floors, stripping back walls, etc to make good the construction is quite impractical before even trying to retrofit smoke control so the usual approach is for a full evacuation policy which requires the fire alarm system as described in the FRA.

As a leaseholder you would be liable for a proportion of the costs as would the other leaseholders who let out rather than occupy.

[Guest SANDALWOOD]

can you help please.   live in a estate with 7 freehold houses -     directors of resident management company  to whom we all pay for outside communual areas.   gardening,  electric gates, electric supply -   lights.     i have asked the directors and company for a copy of the risk assessments but they will not let me have one.     what can i do

advice  please

[AnthonyB]

If there are no internal common areas and also the estate is 7 distinct houses (rather than flats)  then they won't supply you with a fire risk assessment as there is no legal requirement for one as the relevant legislation does not apply.

[Guest John Smith]

I am one of two owners of a purpose built two storey building with a flat on each floor. There are no common parts and the building was newly constructed in about 2005 and totally fire separated. Does a fire risk assessment need to be done? If so, does each owner do his own as there are no common parts or is it the responsibility of the freeholder?

[AnthonyB]

On 20/12/2024 at 18:50, Guest John Smith said:

I am one of two owners of a purpose built two storey building with a flat on each floor. There are no common parts and the building was newly constructed in about 2005 and totally fire separated. Does a fire risk assessment need to be done? If so, does each owner do his own as there are no common parts or is it the responsibility of the freeholder?

In theory the freeholder should assess the external walls based on the way the regulations have been written although some Government guidance has said it's not meant to apply to these types of property (which are very low risk anyway)